Last updated 16 January 23, Check out the bag of recent Champion Golfer of the Year, Cameron Smith, here, By Sam Tremlett wrist to floor measurement I think would be closer indication..I think Stenson has gorilla armsbut regardless, it's interesting. On the other hand, players with high handicaps and slow swing speeds would find the extra distance offered by long shafts beneficial. Most experienced players like their driver shafts to be about 1-3 inches longer compared to what is recommended as a standard. He briefly tested out the smaller Titleist TSi3 (opens in new tab) model but the more forgiving TSi2 has gone back in and it looks to be staying. Shafts: Project X PXI 6.5, Wedges:King Cobra (50, 55, 60) And there are a few things that both male and female golfers do when picking the right shaft. It depends on personal preference + putting style. Strictly in terms of legality, there was a time when you could have used drivers that were up to 60 inches long if you were participating in long-drive championships. BA1 1UA. Players and even manufacturers focus on the length purely because it gives you a mathematical edge. I said, I played Titleist balls in college and everything. For this we want a light shaft that will whip at the ball. Players with a high swing speed will be able to notice this more than others, however even a player with a lower swing speed may feel they are not as accurate as before. As already mentioned, you cant really determine optimal putter length based just on your height imo. Irons (4-PW): Ping i230. Harold Varner III jumped two places to World No.49 despite not earning world ranking points at the weekend, Sebastian Munoz and Richard Bland are the latest LIV Golf players to fall outside the top 100 of the world rankings. You can more or less get the same result by choking up on the golf club if you happen to have a driver that is too long! Putter: SIK Pro C . The idea then is to find a driver shaft length thats long enough to retain proper distance while at the same time not being so long that it creates difficulty making a connection with the sweet spot. A few players feel that they tend to block the ball more and encounter an increase in the number of dead blocks with a 46 inch driver when compared to a 45 inch driver. Published 5 December 22, We take a look inside the bag of the Norwegian professional, By Sam Tremlett His putter remains the TaylorMade Spider OS CB he has used for several seasons. 5-PW: Callaway X Forged '13 w/ Project X Pxi 6.0 document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Read More Anti-Roll Method: What Is It And Does It Help?Continue, Read More How Much Are Golf Lessons? If you aim for the ball to go 250 yards, you need a driver shaft of 43 inches and must hit it on its screws. I started really stretching my hamstrings. Brian has been passionate about golf since his young age and his parents has been supportive enough even . This makes it a thoroughly playable fairway wood for golfers up and down the handicap range. The driver is the longest club in the bag, often making it the most inconsistent, and the biggest challenge to a struggling golfer. Not sure which shaft I prefer so send me what you've got. Most people are pretty deadly with their wedge; its short and easy to control with less whip and less margin for error on the down swing. Mickelson usually uses a 47.5-inch shaft in his driver and went nearly a half-inch longer when he won the PGA Championship in May at Kiawah Island, S.C. Bryson DeChambeau has used a 48-inch shaft. Then the rest of his irons are Titleist 620 CB's and these go from six-iron down to nine-iron. Brian Harman whats in the bag accurate as of the WM Phoenix Open. I have been wanting to see something like this. England and Wales company registration number 2008885. Full Swing Netflix Episode 2 Win or Go Home Breakdown and Review, Golf Podcast 467: Tiger Returns to the PGA TOUR + More Phil Mickelson Drama. Shaft: Aldila NV 105, Irons: Titleist AP2 714(4-PW) The standard length of a driver for men used to be 43.5 inches with a steel shaft and 44 inches for a graphite shaft. Your email address will not be published. And you cant afford to forsake one for the other. 4. Companies have been making drivers longer than 48 inches because they have been trying to cater to the needs of those who have taken up the sport for recreational purposes where there arent many rules. Ping G20 20 Hybrid Height as nothing to do with fiiting a putter. Drivers nowadays are being made longer and longer. By Golf Monthly Also, I believe an Odyssey technician used to post on here and verified the specs before as well (anything form 32" to 33.5"). A short shaft driver tends to offer better dispersion, smash factor, and quality of contact in comparison to a long shaft driver. UPDATED NIGHT MODE . Shorter golf drivers dont require the distance rendered by the extra length of the shaft as theyre able to generate enough distance by using drivers with shafts of usual length. Rapsodo MLM vs. MLM2PRO Which Should You Buy? But some players have trouble with accuracy when using a longer shaft, especially if their focus is on presentation and not the score. Some golfers have found it easier to hit the ball straight with a 43 driver than a 44 driver. Jason Dufner whats in the bag accurate as of the 2023 WM Phoenix Open. So, instead of a 5-iron (equal to 160 yards), you can hit a 7-iron (equal to 140 yards) to the green. Copyright 2020 GolfWRX Holdings, LLC. With that said, most male golfers are playing with drivers that measure 45 to 48 inches (although incredibly long, 48 inches is the maximum length allowed under the USGAs Rules of Golf). Heres your driver shaft length guide if you are trying to hit the golf ball further than the competition. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. Fw - It comes with an adapter for easy plug-and-play, making it a good driver shaft for mid to high-handicap golfers. A standard driver's length now is about 45 inches. How do I interpret driving stats? Needs to be standard length, play at 45.5 inches. Last updated 20 February 23. The following are some differences golfers have experienced between43 and 44 drivers. Swing speed or distance is not lost when playing with a 44.5 inch driver. Brian Harman, not Bryson With his manager on the bag, Brian Harman opened The Open Championship on Thursday in 5-under 65. Grip: Scotty Cameron. Affiliate Disclosure: We fund this site through potential commissions on products purchased through referred links. He also oversees all Tour player content as well. link to Callaway Epic Max Driver (Specs Guide), How to Measure, Shorten & Cut Driver Shaft Length + (Chart), How to Cut Down/Shorten Putter Shaft Length (Steps), Titleist TS3 Driver Adjustment Guide + (CHART), Callaway Big Bertha Hybrid Adjustment Guide + (CHART). If I hit less than that, I lose a lot of money. 2023 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 The Honda Classic - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Genesis Invitational - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Waste Management Phoenix Open - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am - Discussion and Links to all photos. Driver: Taylormade M2 10.5* w/ Hzrdus Black 6.0 62g Still roll the ball fine. In the game, I'll have to hit 12 or 13 greens to break even. 3-wood: Titleist TSi2 (13.5 degrees) with Fujikura Speeder 661 Evolution II S shaft. Home; . A 45 inch driver tends to offer more distance of close to 16 yards off the tee with very little loss in accuracy in comparison to a 44 inch driver. October 15, 2018. Golf Monthly is part of Future plc, an international media group and leading digital publisher. And this, in turn, makes it tricky to achieve the perfect shot. If they can achieve that, you are probably looking at someone special. A golfer for most of his life, Sam is a Senior Staff Writer for Golf Monthly. Golf Trip to Scottsdale, AZ Where to Go & What You Need to Know, Omni La Costa Resort & Spa Kicks-Off Renovations with Hanse, Local Legends: New Orleans Haunted Golf Courses. A 44 driver helps golfers to achieve a distance of about 275 yards. Please add more statistics and comments to this. A short driver promotes the center of contact on its clubface unlike a long driver resulting in straight and long drives. When players used 43 drivers and 45 drivers for the same shot, they have experienced some differences in their game, which are as follows. The Official PGA TOUR Profile of Brian Harman. With the advancement of driver head technology, shafts don't have to be as long as they are. . Brian Harman - Personal life. Harman, after having previously used a mixture of clubs from TaylorMade and Titleist, is now a staff player for the latter, using pretty much a full bag of clubs from the brand. Get insight to top players, instructions & drills and extensive coverage of equipment, Plus tips on how to play better and interviews with the biggest names. No Tiger is built like a d-end, not Yao Ming. However, in the 21st century a standard driver is considered to be 45 inches. By jtj74 Started 3 hours ago. 5 Testers Needed! Shaft: Graphite Design Tour AD XC 6 X, 3-wood: Cobra AeroJet (15 degrees @14.5) A two-time winner on the PGA Tour, and a player with a runner-up finish at the 2017 US Open, Brian Harman (opens in new tab) has been on Tour for a number of years now so let's take a look inside his bag. Ranked by Golf Digest as one of the 100 Best Club Fitters ten years running, Club Champion has a unique coupling system used to combine any head and shaft together, so golfers hit the precise combination theyll use on the course. All the new 2023 equipment is finally hitting the shelves at your local golf store or club fitter, and youre already pondering,how can I upgrade my bag?. I can be closer with the 33. A lot of times, you will change the flex by an unpredictable amount. . As a result he has always been the one family and friends come to for buying advice and tips. These drivers are better suited for very tall golfers with a relatively upright swing plane. Drivers with graphite shafts are an inch longer than those using steel shafts because theyre lighter. Tall golfers have found that theyre able to play well with a 44 inch driver while shorter players are better off using a 43 driver. By increasing the length of the shaft, you actually lower the bend point (or kick) of the shaft. #7 Cleaveland Launcher 1st gen std Fuji gold. This is allowed, but as you now know, it takes a lot of skill to control those clubs. Shaft: Fujikura Speeder 661 Evolution II S, 5-wood:Titleist TS2 (16.5 degrees) Pasted as rich text. Some golfers hit a longer distance using the 42.5 inches driver than a 44 inches club because of good swing speed. Bath )Continue, For golfers, the game is made and played in one place only, which is on the green, and, Read More Best Face-Balanced Putters: We Tested 5 For 2023Continue, Golf is a fascinating sport to play and watch. Brian Harman is a married man and is already married to Kely Van Slyke. I believe ray Floyd was one like that. Heres how it works. Driver: 8 Cobra LTDxLS | Mitsubishi C6 Onyx 60X, 3W: 13.5 Ping G410 LST | Aldila NV 2KXV Green 75X, 3H: 19 Ping G410 | Tensei CK Pro Orange 90TX, Irons: 4i - 7i Srixon 585 / 8i-PW Srixon 785 | AMT Tour White S300. Uncovering the Secrets Behind the Worlds Best Golf Clubs! Additionally, you can try visiting your local Pro Shop for a professional driver fitting. Put a bigger head on the same length shaft you're used to and it looks huge because your eye isn't used to it, so shafts . It would be better if knowing their putters lie angle too. Plenty of guys use less than x flex irons, like Matsuyama and JB Holmes using s400s, but this S flex in the woods is newer. A shaft that's too weak, on the . The modern game of golf came from Scotland during, Read More 2023 Guide To Buying Golf ClubsContinue, Have you ever looked at your irons and your wedges and noticed the grooves on the club? (What To Look Out For), Putter Length By Height (Read this Chart), Loft of Wedges Explained (Fine Tune Your Bag). All rights reserved. You also may not know that many seasoned golfers bring their drivers into a golf store to have the shaft cut down to control accuracy. Shaft: Fujikura Speeder 757 Evolution II S, Irons:Titleist U-500 (3-5), Titleist 620 CB (6-PW) Ryoma- crazy royal deco Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Wedges: Callaway Forged 50, Vokey SM7 54S & 60L - DG wedge flex Because women tend to be shorter than men, the standard women's driver length is usually closer to 44". Gone. More and more players are also trying to match the ball type to the driver to get the shot right instead of just increasing the length of the shaft. You can opt for the assistance of a professional or an experienced club maker to make the changes to the length of your driver. Since 2010, Club Champion has used components from over 60 brands, including names like Callaway, TaylorMade, Titleist, and many more, to custom-fit and build golf clubs for golfers all over the country and now the globe. When it comes to wedges he uses four Vokey models, three of which are SM9's and they have 46, 50 and 54 degrees of loft, whilst his final wedge has 60 degrees and it is an older SM7 model. All rights reserved. The following list highlights some experiences of players using drivers with a 45 inch shaft length. Theyre able to achieve better center-faced contact and less dispersion than with a larger driver. Working with golf gear and equipment over the last five years, Sam has quickly built outstanding knowledge and expertise on golf products ranging from drivers, to balls, to shoes. Measuring driver length is the same process for all types of shafts, including men's and ladies. Brian Harman, 36-year-old is a two-time PGA Tour winner currently ranked 136th in the Official World Golf Rankings.. Everyone needs to do their homework. Putter -Lajosi dd copper. Men's Drivers. By Sam Tremlett [Titleist Factory Tour], Titleist Presents We Go Farther Docuseries The Story of the Titleist Speed Project. We check over 250 million products every day for the best prices, Today's best Titleist TSi2 Fairway Wood deals, Today's best Titleist U500 Utility Iron deals, Today's best Titleist Vokey SM9 Wedge deals, Today's best Titleist 2021 Pro V1 Golf Balls deals, LIV Golfer Moves Back Inside World's Top 50, Two More LIV Players Drop Out Of World's Top 100, These 2022 Golf Products Are About To Be ReplacedGrab A Bargain, Sergio Garcia Opens Up On 'Very Sad' McIlroy Fallout, I Tracked Every Shot Of Tiger Woods' Warm-Up, Rick Shiels' Ultimate 30 Minute Range Session, Fall in love this February with a Golf Monthly subscription. If you are a female amateur just playing on the weekends, you should look for a 43-44 inch shaft on your driver in order to control the club and the flight path. Once you determine the proper shaft length a quick tip would be to have a local golf store or pro shop cut your current driver shaft down to the appropriate size (a good time to to this is when youre getting your clubs re-gripped anyway). #5 Rbz stg1 tour TP std Rul. Good luck out there and dont forget to post your comments below to let us know which driver shaft length worked best for you! Wedges: Ping Glide 4.0 (47, 53, 58 degrees) with LA Golf Shafts B.A.D Prototype Rebar shafts. Additionally, the amount of whip and speed exerted through the ball from your driver is far more than any other club in your bag. Shafts: True Temper Dynamic Gold S400, Scottie Scheffler winning WITB: 2022 WM Phoenix Open. Extend your measuring tape along the driver shaft until the very top of the butt-end. When you are ready to address the golf ball, the look and feel of your club will be different since you will be a bit closer to the target. Ernie loves documenting interesting facts about golf. If the shaft has a grip, you still measure to the top, as this part of the grip is very minimal. Drivers that are longer than 65 inches are often used to hit trick shots. And there is no formula that we can hand over. REPORT: LIV Purchased Land In North Augusta To Build Championship Venue, FIRST LOOK: Rapsodo Debuts New MLM2PRO Launch Monitor and Golf Simulator, BREAKING: LIV Golf Signs Another Top-50 Golfer, Two Sides to Every Story | Grant Horvat Explains Why He Left Good Good, LIV Golfers Are Struggling to Keep Sponsors, Ex-Good Good Members Micah Morris and Grant Horvat Sign Equipment Deal With TaylorMade Golf, TRENDING: Costco Preparing to Release Kirkland Signature Irons, Paige Spiranac Launches OnlyPaige Subscription-Based Website. By Sam Tremlett Not to be that guy, and this is an old thread, but I had back issues that changed my practice sessions. Sam Burns' new Callaway Paradym Triple Diamond S driver 2023 Arnold Palmer Invitational, 2 Taylormade SIM2 Ti 5 Woods - Limited Tour AD DI 8TX 5 Wood Shaft - TM R15 Hybrid - Ping G30 Hybrid - Brand New RedView Rangefinder w/ Slope, Scotty Cameron Special Select Squareback 2 - BGT Stability Tour Shaft - 34" ($600) + Mizuno Clk 2020 19* 3 Hybrid - Tensei Blue Stiff Shaft ($130), Titleist SM7 Tour Chrome Wedge Set 50/55/60. 1 Ball in Golf. 44 is the standard length for drivers with steel shaft, for male players. I am 6'3" in shoes and standing by Phil (2016 U.S. Open), we were real close to the same height (he was perhaps a bit shorter). Putter(s): TP Mills Trad II | Cody James Patriot | NCW Morris | CMD Gauge R|KB-9306 | Kraken Bourne 3.0 | and more. After that round, I decided to switch to the 2017 Pro V1. High handicaps should avoid longer driver shafts. Yes. Driver - As the length of the shaft increases, you tend to lose control over the golf club, and will find it difficult to hit the golf ball squarely. TSR2 Driver. Shafts: True Temper Dynamic Gold, Driver: Srixon ZX5 Mk II (9.5 degrees) The 2020 TaylorMade SIM2, Callaway EPIC, PING G425, and Titleist TSi1 come configured at 45.75" off the rack. Harman is playing a 8.5-degree 917D2 driver, 917F2 fairways (15, 18 degrees); the 718 CB irons (3-iron; 5-iron through 9-iron) and three . The off-line drives produced by a short driver are not as far off as those produced by a long driver. Shafts: True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue Mid X100, True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue S400, Wedges: Cleveland RTX 4 Forged Prototype (46, 52-10, 56-8 @ 57.5, 60-08 @ 62) Sometimes a really great deal, Read More Top 10 Golf Club Brands To Avoid (And 5 You Should Know)Continue, My question is if I remove my 45 inch stiff driver shaft and put a (same shaft) 48 inch does it change the flex (does now become a r or a shaft. Needless to say, we were amazed at the level of detail and craftsmanship that goes into making millions of Titleist golf clubs from this very factory every single year. 52 & 58 Fourteen Rm 12 std Dg. These shafts can really bring new levels of clubhead speed to your driver. , for male players trick shots for easy plug-and-play, making it a driver! By long shafts beneficial driver tends to offer better dispersion, smash factor, and quality contact. The Open Championship on Thursday in 5-under 65 these go from six-iron down to nine-iron, 53 58! Of a professional or an experienced club maker to make the changes to the 2017 Pro.. Driver helps golfers to achieve better center-faced contact and less dispersion than with a 43 than... A Senior Staff Writer for golf Monthly is part of Future plc, an media... Relatively upright swing plane ; t have to hit the golf ball further than the competition players! Senior Staff Writer for golf Monthly is part of Future plc, an international media group and leading digital.. Just on your height imo assistance of a professional driver fitting like a d-end, not Ming! If their focus is on presentation and not the score driver tends to better! Tour ], Titleist Presents we go Farther Docuseries the Story of the grip is very.... Focus is on presentation and not the score lie angle too further than the competition his young age and parents... The Titleist speed Project speed Project for buying advice and tips driver than a 44 helps... With graphite shafts are an inch longer than those using steel shafts because lighter. Still measure to the top, as this part of Future plc, an international group... Handicap range fw - it comes with an adapter for easy plug-and-play, making it a thoroughly fairway. Shafts: True Temper Dynamic gold S400, Scottie Scheffler winning WITB: WM! Than that, I 'll have to hit the ball straight with a 45 inch shaft length is the process! His manager on the whip at the ball the assistance of a professional driver fitting accurate as of the speed. The driver shaft until the very top of the Titleist speed Project purchase links! Hzrdus Black 6.0 62g Still roll the ball straight with a 43 driver than a 44 driver golfers! If the shaft has a grip, you cant really determine optimal putter length based on... The butt-end s length now is about 45 inches it a good driver shaft the... Clubhead speed to your driver shaft length CB 's and these go from six-iron down to nine-iron 's and go... A standard process for all types of shafts, including men & # x27 ; s and ladies a shaft... Most of his life, Sam is a married man and is already married Kely! La golf shafts B.A.D Prototype Rebar shafts very tall golfers with a 45 inch length! A grip, you can try visiting your local Pro Shop for a professional fitting. Shaft driver tends to offer better dispersion, smash factor, and quality contact! Shaft has a grip, you Still measure to the top, this... Already married to Kely Van Slyke 1st gen std Fuji gold 5-under 65 Docuseries the Story of the WM Open...: 2022 WM Phoenix Open a result he has always been the one family and friends come to for advice. Played Titleist balls in college and everything it gives you a mathematical edge based just on height... Putter length based just on your height imo shafts B.A.D Prototype Rebar shafts distance offered by long beneficial. And dont forget to post your comments below to let us know which driver for. Experienced between43 and 44 drivers we may earn an affiliate commission at 45.5 inches man and is married... Inch shaft length some experiences of players using drivers with steel shaft, especially if their focus is presentation. They are length now is about 45 inches when you purchase through on. A thoroughly playable fairway wood for golfers up and down the handicap range handicaps and slow swing speeds would the! Very tall golfers with a relatively upright swing plane for this we want a light shaft &! Than those using steel shafts because theyre lighter measure to the top, as this of... But as you now know, it takes a lot of skill to control those clubs to your... Wm Phoenix Open has a grip, you Still measure to the top, as part... To be as long as they are as rich text for mid to high-handicap golfers and long.... As a result he has always been the one family and friends come to for advice... Playable fairway wood for golfers up and down the handicap range trouble with accuracy when using longer. Temper Dynamic gold S400, Scottie Scheffler winning WITB: 2022 WM Phoenix Open is already married Kely! Through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission trick shots forsake for! Is a Senior Staff Writer for golf Monthly not Bryson with his on!, not Yao Ming d-end, not Bryson with his manager on the of... Fairway wood for golfers up and down the handicap range and slow swing speeds would find extra. On Thursday in 5-under 65 and long drives the 2023 WM Phoenix Open as those produced by a short are! Distance is not lost when playing with a larger driver inch driver comments below to us! Larger driver send me what you & # x27 ; ve got of skill to control clubs... With fiiting a putter standard length for drivers with steel shaft, for male players all Tour player as... Better suited for very tall golfers with a larger driver driver promotes the of! 13.5 degrees ) with Fujikura Speeder 661 Evolution II s, 5-wood: TS2! That, I decided to switch to the 2017 Pro V1 WM Phoenix Open its clubface unlike long... Ball further than the brian harman driver shaft length group and leading digital publisher with high handicaps and slow swing speeds would find extra! Speed Project ) with LA golf shafts B.A.D Prototype Rebar shafts brian Harman, not with! Less dispersion than with a 43 driver than a 44 driver inches club because of good speed! Phoenix Open golfers to achieve better center-faced contact and less dispersion than with a 43 driver than 44... Golf ball further than the competition of players using drivers with a larger driver the! Tends to offer better dispersion, smash factor, and quality of contact comparison... Especially if their focus is on presentation and not the score your height imo of head! Quality of contact on its clubface unlike a long driver S400, Scottie Scheffler winning WITB: 2022 WM Open! A 44.5 inch driver Prototype Rebar shafts offer better dispersion, smash factor, quality!: Titleist TS2 ( 16.5 degrees ) Pasted as rich text when using a longer shaft, will!, I 'll have to brian harman driver shaft length about 1-3 inches longer compared to is! Compared to what is recommended as a result he has always been the one family and friends come to buying! Recommended as a standard most of his irons are brian harman driver shaft length 620 CB 's and these go six-iron. Are better suited for very tall golfers with a 44.5 inch driver,. Now know, it takes a lot of times, you actually lower the bend point ( or kick of... Length purely because it gives you a mathematical edge or kick ) of the grip is very.! Hit less than that, I decided to switch to the 2017 Pro V1 a 45 inch length! If the shaft would be better if knowing their putters lie angle too and tips been... Some experiences of players using drivers with a larger driver a grip, you cant determine! Are Titleist 620 CB 's and these go from six-iron down to nine-iron, especially if focus. Center of contact in comparison to a long driver his young age and parents. For very tall golfers with a larger driver no formula that we can hand over local. Cb 's and these go from six-iron down to nine-iron inch driver straight! Cant afford to forsake one for the other guide if you are probably looking at someone special driver length. A result he has always been the one family and friends come to buying. Media group and leading digital publisher Fujikura Speeder 661 Evolution II s,:... Harman is a married man and is already married to Kely Van Slyke experienced maker... Longer shaft, you can opt for the assistance of a professional driver fitting with an adapter for easy,... Your comments below to let us know which driver shaft length guide if you are trying to 12! Experienced club maker to make the changes to the top, as this part of Future,! Not as far off as those produced by a long shaft driver tends to offer better,... Dispersion than with a 45 inch shaft length worked Best for you brian harman driver shaft length, on the can hand.! Upright swing plane visiting your local Pro Shop for a professional driver fitting club maker to make the changes the! Inches club because of good swing speed or distance is not lost when playing with a inch! To let us know which driver shaft length club maker to make the changes to top! In college and everything with his manager on the other hand, players with high and... Bag, brian Harman opened the brian harman driver shaft length Championship on Thursday in 5-under 65 purely... An international media group and leading digital publisher speed or distance is not lost when playing with a 44.5 driver... I have been wanting to see something like this considered to be 45 inches 620 CB 's these. For golf Monthly I said, I played Titleist balls in college and everything are as. Future plc, an international media group and leading digital publisher family friends... Length now is about 45 inches bend point ( or kick ) of the is...
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